An important read regarding Windblade I mentioned this not long inside another post but it warrants its own
boodle boy
An important read regarding Windblade I mentioned this not long inside another post but it warrants its own
An important read regarding Windblade I mentioned this not long inside another post but it warrants its own
boodle boy
I feel like I should reiterate that Windblade, especially abstractly has its merits and the character is one who I am genuinely happy EXISTS
boodle boy
But man oh man.
boodle boy
I'm excited that it looks like we're gonna see Cybertron next issue of RiD
boodle boy
I'm excited to see BARBER write Wimbles
liver.lung.fr!
MMM YES PLEASE
Rodda
i love windblade but man it was p flawed
Rodda
i agree totally with that post and the responses
proletaricat
I said it before when you linked this, but yeah, agreed on all counts.
🐅 its harry
yes yes yes
rar
I agree with all of these tbh. I found windblade's characterization to be all over the place. Like if I try to list 5 notable character traits for her I kind of run a blank
rar
Like that doesn't include her job or role in the comic
🐅 its harry
lmao yeah seriously
🐅 its harry
im writing this app and im always like, fretting over things being consistent w canon when it comes to personality, and having to remind myself that that is, in fact, a lost cause
boodle boy
I also have some serious issues with the dismissive and attitudes of the creative team towards any not overwhelming-positive discussion of their work. It's incredibly unprofessional and disheartening 
🐅 its harry
ugh
boodle boy
Lol I have faith in you Harry
rar
I also liked when Milne made her the tall one in dark Cybertron :'[
rar
In fact as much as I rip on dark Cybertron their portrayal there is a lot better
rar
Or at least WBs
boodle boy
Especially because by and large the rest of the TF writers/artists are quite open to communication
boodle boy
Yeah I agree - WB was in DC for but a scant few moment and I actually enjoyed her potential there a lot
🐅 its harry
yeah! i need to reread that sliver of womble ,
🐅 its harry
.. ok i meant wimble
🐅 its harry
but.
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you know what, i cant really bring myself to correct myself
boodle boy
I hate pulling this card, because women in comics have to wrestle with and overcome a lot of stuff men don't, but sometimes I just put my chin on my hand and wonder
boodle boy
Would people really let this BS slide if the creative team had been men?
🐅 its harry
honestly? probably
🐅 its harry
i think youd be seeing a lot more of the same "why arent you grateful theres women at all"
🐅 its harry
there might be a bit less "why arent you grateful women are being allowed to write this at all" but i think if anything it might be balanced out by the gratitude that a male creative team was like
🐅 its harry
lowering themselves to writing about women tbh.
🐅 its harry
Who Can Say Tho
liver.lung.fr!
I think it would have slid differently probably
liver.lung.fr!
Yeah
boodle boy
Ugh nothing makes me sadder than the "we should be happy with what we get attitude"
liver.lung.fr!
I mean I'm happy because it's certainly a step? But like. how can we make thing better though!
rar
The way I see it is that it's problematic but it's a step towards having something better?
🐅 its harry
yeah
liver.lung.fr!
Also I'm happy because I liked the comic! But! How can we make thing better tho!
🐅 its harry
but like youve got to complain bc otherwise how are they going to know you want something better
boodle boy
Exactly; I don't expect better of the sequel because I don't think the problems were heard by a creative team who blatantly shut down discussion and made it clear they don't want to hear what people have to say
🐅 its harry
yeah :/
boodle boy
I'm glad this comic exists and I want Wimbledon and the other ladies around
🐅 its harry
WIMBLEDON...
liver.lung.fr!
I just don't understand the attitude of people who want to facilitate better art being 'ungrateful'
Falcon McRaven
I'm cackling thank you for that
🐅 its harry
i guess its the concern that if some women complain then the men will decide its not worth trying to 'appease' them
boodle boy
But man I think IDW should drop Scott while they still can cause she ain't that good and she's not bringing anything positive to this industry
🐅 its harry
yeah pls hire different women
boodle boy
BUT THEN, who cares about that when there's money to be made hahaaaaa
boodle boy
COMICS.
🐅 its harry
like if she seemed keen to improve than i wouldnt mind that this comic was not very good .. .
liver.lung.fr!
I feel bad for the creative team because I got the sense that they felt like they were getting shit from literally all sides but. That doesn't excuse the response obviously.
🐅 its harry
*then
liver.lung.fr!
Like I get not wanting to hear that your comic isn't feminist enough while you're also having to field disgusting slurs and threats about said comic but that also doesn't. Make your comic any better!
liver.lung.fr!
sssooooo
boodle boy
Man can understand that, but the way they handled it was dismissive as hell. And considering most of the shit they were getting was calling them out on legitimate social problems, I don't think it's uncalled
boodle boy
The slurs and stuff are obviously uncalled for
🐅 its harry
yeah like. i get being defensive but if people are flinging that kind of shit at you then you want the people who are concerned about social issues to be on your side :T
liver.lung.fr!
YEAH I mean from like the dudebro side of the fandom who didn't want the comic to happen at all. And they WERE really vocal, or that's the impression I got
boodle boy
Yeah
boodle boy
but the thing is
boodle boy
I saw the same
boodle boy
literally the same things being said on the Dudebro forum posts as were being said from the female-driven-fandom on tumblr
boodle boy
but, on opposite sides?
boodle boy
It was flabbergasting
liver.lung.fr!
But--yeah, that obviously doesn't excuse a lack of dialogue. I just got the sense they weren't expecting pushback from feminist fans and um WELL THEN WRITE A MORE FEMINIST COMIC, SORRY
boodle boy
I think the problem is Scott got in over her head
boodle boy
she doesn't know and SAID early on that she doesn't know the first thing about gender studies
proletaricat
Yeah, I can absolutely see her getting in over her head
boodle boy
And then proceeded to do interview after interview talking about how she was changing the world with this comic and it was so groundbreaking and feminist and
boodle boy
Like, man let your work SPEAK a little before you do
liver.lung.fr!
Yeah that was the sense I got too which like. Idk. THEN LEARN??? Lady come on
boodle boy
Just the EPITOME of open mouth, insert foot
🐅 its harry
yeah like if youre going to be working in this kind of area then u kind of NEED to know something about gender issues
🐅 its harry
because
boodle boy
Never mind telling people that they are wrong if they don't think in the gender binary
boodle boy
Which i
🐅 its harry
you are going to have to deal with them a lot ....
boodle boy
will NEVER BE OVER.
boodle boy
Sorry
🐅 its harry
lmfao jesus CHRIST
🐅 its harry
GENDER IS A FARCE IM SORRY IF U DIDNT GET THE MEMO
boodle boy
Like, I just don't think she's going to get better because she doesn't want to listen
🐅 its harry
like, she might, but itd take a long time
boodle boy
Yeah
space ass
augh yes, totally agree w/ this plurk
liver.lung.fr!
just finds the largest, saddest YOU TRIED sticker
space ass
there was an attempt
boodle boy
And attempt is about all I can say about that comic
liver.lung.fr!
I'm just--ugh. I really really wanted Windblade to be so good
boodle boy
Also is was a comic.
boodle boy
Like, literally, sequential-ish images on a page
boodle boy
Yeah
liver.lung.fr!
Like I was so fucking excited and it really--mmh
boodle boy
Yeah.
🐅 its harry
windblade definitely took plae
🐅 its harry
place
boodle boy
I was super excited
boodle boy
SO EXCITED
🐅 its harry
it happened. these four issues occurred
boodle boy
I remember those days
boodle boy
And then Scott opened her big
space ass
i paid money for those 80 pieces of paper
boodle boy
mouth.
liver.lung.fr!
Like I feel dumb about how bummed out I was about literally every part of the process
boodle boy
I paid no money, and I am proud.
🐅 its harry
LMKKJhfdg
🐅 its harry
space ass
same. same.
boodle boy
I looked my comic retailer in the eye and said NO SIR. I DO NOT WANT THAT IN MY PULL LIST.
boodle boy
...BUT THANK YOU FOR ASKING.
space ass
gdsjhkd
🐅 its harry
i bought every one. like. i do not regret it. it looks very nice, if u do not attempt to wring too much understanding from it
liver.lung.fr!
And like--I liked Scott's other stuff and I still really like Sarah Stone's art even if it wasn't. Idk. Good for the comic or whatever.
boodle boy
abstract
space ass
i like... . .. .... ..the colors?
liver.lung.fr!
I'm glad I paid for it because it means they might make more better things later
space ass
puts face in hands
boodle boy
Yeah, my problem with Sarah Stone falls squarely on comic politics (and her not being good a sequential story telling) in that
🐅 its harry
its very brightly coloured. yeah
boodle boy
I think artists ahve a social responsibility
liver.lung.fr!
But rereading it just sort of makes me miserable now
boodle boy
particuarly when they become professionals.
🐅 its harry
yeah
boodle boy
I know not everyone agrees with that, but AS an artist, that's what I think
space ass
yeah absolutely
boodle boy
I don't have TIME to deal with artists who just draw pretty white men, and ocassionally willowy girls if they are paid enough
boodle boy
There are too many other good artists
boodle boy
who are willign to make the changes that need to happen, happen.
🐅 its harry
wordd
space ass
y e p
boodle boy
The comic industry may still be dumb, and backward and filled with every -ism in the book, but it IS getting better, and more and more people are reading comics.
🐅 its harry
like i super appreciate that they did a comic with women in it and hired women to do it thats great but like, there are a lot of other comics with women in that are written and/or drawn by women around at the
🐅 its harry
moment
boodle boy
If you can't bring positive change to that industry, then just....don't. Like, please don't contribute to this problem. Draw what you want somewhere else.
🐅 its harry
that are doing extremely well
boodle boy
Yeah!
🐅 its harry
and its like
boodle boy
Tons.
🐅 its harry
this isnt good enough?
boodle boy
Like
🐅 its harry
this isnt remotely good enough
boodle boy
I remember having this discussion once about how people are like OH LOOK, WOMEN IN THE COMIC INDUSTRY WHAT A RARE AND SPECIAL BIRD
boodle boy
like and inthe MAINSTREAM, that's true, yeah
boodle boy
But it's pretty dismissive
boodle boy
and ignorant of how in the indie and small press bracket...
boodle boy
women in comics are thriving
🐅 its harry
mmmmm
boodle boy
They compromise a relatively equal part
boodle boy
And slowly, some of those comics are getting recognition and self-publishing is becoming such that people can get their hands on things they never would before
boodle boy
But don't pretend that these creators and these comics, not just women but ANY minority don't exist
boodle boy
You gotta fucking find and support that shit and be VOCAL ABOUT IT
🐅 its harry
like... windblade started coming out basically the same time as, like, lumberjanes? like, youve got no excuse
boodle boy
yeah
boodle boy
fucking
boodle boy
RAT QUEENS
space ass
i have not read rat queens yet but what i've seen is SO GOOD
🐅 its harry
same
space ass
SO GOOD
boodle boy
omg you would both LOVE IT SO MUCH
boodle boy
it's phenom
🐅 its harry
SO I HEAR
🐅 its harry
god windblade could have been fuckin great
space ass
im going to have to start picking it up soon...
space ass
and it really could have been
space ass
augh
boodle boy
IT COULD HAVE BEEN GREAT
boodle boy
I WANTED SO BADLY FOR IT TO BE GREAT
🐅 its harry
or just .. good .. even ... like
boodle boy
TF comics are sooooo good right now
🐅 its harry
i could have forgiven the shoddy panel layout if windblade had a personality,,
boodle boy
Yeah, ditto
boodle boy
Like, absolutely
boodle boy
Because, I feel like
boodle boy
that can easily be fixed
boodle boy
and also isn't a social issue lol
boodle boy
But c'mon Wimbles
🐅 its harry
if were going to have this few female characters i think it is important that they be good characters like ffs
boodle boy
Yeah I agree - the abassadorial female characters
boodle boy
I am also forever buttmad that they didn't take the obvious
boodle boy
and best
boodle boy
solution to lady-bot explaination
boodle boy
"WE JUST LIKE FEMALE PRONOUNS DEEEAL WITH IT"
boodle boy
And then party music starts and people start switching pronouns
boodle boy
and its all good
boodle boy
maybe not that second part, that's a little much, but I would settle with the first
boodle boy
I wish I had a photograph of my face when I found out the explaination was their were another colony
boodle boy
just
boodle boy
no wait
boodle boy
boodle boy
yeah this is definitely it.
space ass
yeah. yeah wow
boodle boy
And through the entire comic they insisted upon underlining that fact
boodle boy
by calling them aliens
boodle boy
and bringing it up and making it a pivotal plot point
space ass
<___>
boodle boy
BECAUSE
boodle boy
BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO WRITE AND ORIGIN STORY THAT WAS LESS ALIENATING TO WOMEN
boodle boy
HA
boodle boy
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
🐅 its harry
🐅 its harry
wait no this is better 
boodle boy
no, yes that one is perfect
space ass
WHATS LESS ALIENATING THAN BEING LITERALLY FROM ANOTHER PLACE IN THE UNIVERSE
space ass
NOTHING, RIGHT??
space ass
GREAT IDEA GUYS
W(erewolf)ILF
holy heck
boodle boy
Another, isolated place
🐅 its harry
and its not even like EVERYBODY THERE IS GIRLS right like u dont even get to imagine some kind of robot amazon space hive its like THEY EVOLVED TO HAVE BINARY GENDER THERE fuck off mate
boodle boy
because the only way any one would choose to be be binary coded-female is if it was the only option in their society
boodle boy
🐅 its harry
space ass
"they evolved to have binary gender there" CLENCHES FISTS WITH RAGE
space ass
punches through ten walls while singing "rolling in the deep" by adele
🐅 its harry
i guess like sometimes u just. forget? that most people do not think of gender primarily in social/cultural terms
W(erewolf)ILF
CONFUSED SCREAMING??? WOW
🐅 its harry
like i was talking to one of my old friends abt some worldbuilding junk he was doing with some aliens he had and he wanted to shake things up a bit with gender and hit me up for some help
🐅 its harry
and he was like "well ive got these races of space ppl where they have like a male sex a female sex and a sterile third sex bc of reasons but im not sure what to do about pronouns"
🐅 its harry
and like hed put tons of thought into this and wanted to make it non earthy but he was still totally predicating it on male+female+extra genders maybe??
boodle boy
HMMMM
boodle boy
Yeah, I feel like
🐅 its harry
and im like ok well what if in this society instead of the specific role any individual plays in reproduction they think of gender exclusively in terms of sterile/fertile and the fertile guys are all the same
🐅 its harry
gender regardless of what role they play reproductively bc what youve told me about their culture suggests thats the biggest social division
boodle boy
mm yes
🐅 its harry
and he was like "MY MIND IS BLOWN I WOULD HAVE NEVER THOUGHT OF THAT WHY ARE YOU SO GOOD AT WORLDBUILDING" and im like ...
boodle boy
XD
🐅 its harry
thats literally just the logical first step based on like
boodle boy
I feel like it's actually a really big conceptual leap for a lot of people?
🐅 its harry
/gestures.
🐅 its harry
yeah. exactly
boodle boy
It becomes VERY obvious in cases like that where people are creating aliens
boodle boy
because
boodle boy
ANYTHING goes
🐅 its harry
right
boodle boy
and it's always not just so, earth-based but HUMAN
🐅 its harry
and most of the time people just .. yeah
🐅 its harry
its like
boodle boy
Because there are even lots of species on earth that don't even distantly follow our idea of a binary
space ass
and a lot of human cultures too!
🐅 its harry
even real earth human cultures have more differentiated gender systems than this,
boodle boy
(or at all realistically, in terms of behavioural expectations)
🐅 its harry
did u even try,
boodle boy
Or the fact that like, really a multi-gendered system is sort of a quirk of evolution on earth....it would be simple for any entire biosphere to evolve without divided reproduction - reproduction where all
boodle boy
individuals are viable
🐅 its harry
yeah
boodle boy
It actually makes MORE sense
boodle boy
But yeah, people definitely just tend to default to Men and Women
🐅 its harry
after having been prolongedly super into homestuck i just like......
🐅 its harry
mouth fart noise
boodle boy
and if they're feeling CRAZY